Nazi UFOs

[Iseke]

Jul 14, 2011 6:25:05 GMT -5 Storm said:

The book explains that Stalin used Mengele and his creations to stage a phony ET invasion intended to scare the American people so badly that the country would erupt into chaos. Stalin was confident, the books says, that his plan would work because the 1938 radio play “War of the Worlds” had sent Americans into panic.

I hope this premise isn't what the entire book is based on.

I don't know...these ideas are interesting but...

I just feel like what actually happened was interesting and traumatic enough without needing to tack on all these theories and extras onto it. I'm not saying I won't believe something like this could be possible, or that there weren't complicated undercover things going on with the Nazis, just that it isn't necessary to explain what happened during the Holocaust.

Humans are entirely capable of doing what they did on their own. As for Mengele creating the greys...isn't what he did bad enough without the extraterrestrial elaboration?

[Iseke]

Jul 15, 2011 3:59:23 GMT -5 Storm said:

Iseke, totally!

But I cannot help feeling there is indeed more behind the Nazis and some of what they did, (no matter how unpleasant it is), than meets the eye.

I am a truth seeker. Even if the truth hurts. Yes, man is very capable of inhumanity to man. But if, just if, there was any manipulation by other forces involved in this dark era, in some ways that may even be good thing because it means man may not be so guilty after all. And frankly, I have a lot of faith in humanity and our capacity for beauty too.

I guess for me in some ways I would find it easier to deal with the idea that I was somehow an underground research, (UFO related), experiment in consciousness with regards to integrating H's energy and healing the residual pain frequency, rather than just being a reincarnation of the dude. But that's just me ;D

Also, how do we explain the fact that so many other women are touched by these Nazi dudes now? I have been contacting a lot of them lately. The fan girls, many of which have had their own experiences of these dead Nazis' "spiritual presences", and they all have thier own stories to tell and we can't all be reincarnations of these Nazis! So, if something else is going on, either UFO/secret mind control experiment related or not, then at least it would explain why this phenomenon is happening. I DO believe in reincarnation. I am convinced of my other PL, but that was WAY before the modern UFO and mind control phenomenon and the Third Reich is where the modern UFO and mind control phenomenon began. So I am looking to the phenomenon for answers too in my own journey, just in case it provides any. I just want the truth, ultimately. And in the infamous words of Ghandi, "Even in the minority of one, the truth is still the truth."

I really want to understand that and acknowledge the possibility that there is more than meets the eye, certainly. I don't know, no one knows what's really true, and I agree we should seek the truth whenever possible. But...

I can't help but feel that its purpose is to take away responsibility from the people who perpetrated these things. Saying that aliens were controlling men to act in these ways is comforting because it means that humans can't be held responsible, which I get. Especially when acknowledging a very difficult PL identity, such as in your case.

Again, I'm with you on seeking out the truth. And I am not one to shut doors just because I don't like or agree with something. But I think we need to look at the whole picture here:

1. What does believing in extraterrestrial forces in this event add to our experience?
2. What does not believing in it take away?

Humans are capable of great good and beauty, certainly! But they are also capable of horrible acts, period! No further explanation is needed.

But, if aliens were influencing our thoughts and actions, well....what does that really mean? That means that our thoughts and actions are not our own, and that is a terrifying thought! That means we can't own them, we can't control them, we can't...so what is the point? What is the point in even worrying about it, then?

Taking away our capacity for cruelty by giving our power to aliens and other external forces also takes away our power to act for good, or to act for ourselves at all! I just don't see this as a healthy way to approach anything.

[Laurasia]

Hi SS3.

I think theorising is healthy so long as we do not totally defer all power and responsibility to external factors.

I think that this is indeed the most important factor in all of this. Yet when you make statements such as this....

I guess for me in some ways I would find it easier to deal with the idea that I was somehow an underground research, (UFO related), experiment in consciousness with regards to integrating H's energy and healing the residual pain frequency, rather than just being a reincarnation of the dude.

...it sounds as though you are merely looking for a way to completely seperate yourself from the actions of your past life.

You also need to remember that the vast majority of the members on this forum do not hold belief in UFO phenomena & so, not having the background understanding that your years of research have given to you, we cannot relate to the topic in the same way that you do.

Sincerely,
Laurasia

[Laurasia]

Hi SS3.

I want to apologize if it came across that I was implying that you absolutely were trying to seperate yourself from the situation. I simply wanted to make sure that you were aware to watch for that trap, as it is an easy one for former perpetrators to fall into...trying to "get out" of what they had done. If this is not the case for you than that is fine. I just wanted you to keep in mind that it could have been a possibility is all that I meant.

What you believe is what you believe. It is not my place, nor anyone else's, to tell you what you should or should not believe; & that certainly is not what I am trying to do here. None of us are trying to "force you into believing" any certain thing about exactly how you are reincarnated (or not?) from Heydrich. We are simply trying to help you along with what seems to have been your likely past life in the ways that we are familiar with. Just as most of us were unable to assist former members with their own unorthodox means of reincarnation due to our lack of personal experience in those ways, I dare say that we are having the same issue with this now. I can say for myself that I did not realize that you were referring to having been "reincarnated" from Heydrich in any other way than the "usual way", so that is likely the cause of our misunderstanding. I suspect that the same is probably true with others as well. Now that we all realize that you are not referring to having reincarnated in the "usual way" you will probably not get so many suggestions to "just accept who you were". But please...if you find that many members no longer know how to talk with you about your understanding of reincarnation realize that it is not any sort of slight against you. They, likely, just no longer know what to say since they do not understand the methods that you are referring to. ;D

Sincerely,
Laurasia

[Storm]

Hi Laurasia,

Let's just forgot about any possible misunderstanding, lol. No point falling out over things like that. and I am sincerely grateful for the help and support both you and other members have offered.

I do have views about potential methods of reincarnation and capturing and transferring memories as data and I do feel, in time, there will be a better understanding of it as Soul Catcher, an officially recognised project, gets more publicity.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=2N5nLKhpFKU

www.cs.man.ac.uk/~toby/writing/PCW/upload.htm

Blessings

[Miss Bothmann]

I consider myself a very open minded person, so I am by no means dismissing any theories that have been put forth in this thread. I am in no position to do so because I don't know exactly what is out there in the universe. That being said, I feel that every one is entitled to their beliefs without fear of ridicule from others because...no one truly knows the workings of our universe.

However, I find myself agreeing strongly with comments that Iseke and Laurasia have made. We need to be VERY careful where we place the blame game for the Holocost. In many of my past lives, I have seen the depravity to which ordinary human beings can sink. Placed in certain situations our species is capable of anything. I have seen this done through fear, anger, jealousy...the very root of our dark sides. While I do believe that anything could be possible when it comes to the negativities of WW2, I see this as a more probable case of the dark extremities to which human beings can succumb.

[Storm]

I totally agree, Miss Bothmann. Man is perfectly capable of atrocities and inhumanity to fellow man.

Sadly, this is probably going to carry on, although hopefully we will oneday develop truly peaceful local and global society.

I do take an interest in how potential external factors can affect humans however. Just as with religion, (which may have partly ET origin), and which is responsible for probably more deaths than anything else.

We must definitley never lose sight of the need to be disciplined and not stoop to harming others. But we also have a duty to discover our true place in the universe, and the truth about how the human mind potentially interacts with other factors. Then maybe we will finally grow up as a species and stop all the horror once and for all.

[nreiter]

Good afternoon all,

Since signing in this morning, I have tried to catch up on all of the threads and themes going here, at least a little. So I guess I am at a place where I can start to post some notions and questions without risking too badly the possibility of being a "Dr. Obvious"

Before I get to the point of the point, I also wanted to just add that this is truly an amazing forum - I woulda never thunk it to have existed here! I am really very impressed by the scholarly discussions and gentleness of souls here, and the openness of thought without blame and hate. A very noble effort - again thank you to all the mods and originators here, whoever you are!

Now to get down to it. This particular discussion caught my attention mainly because it hits closest to where my own self-discoveries as well as my external interests (which may or may not have been driven by whatever I did during WWII, in the "blocked life" previous to this one.

Now granted, I am jumping in here with a bit of a bias, since I have been (in this lifetime) in the physical sciences and energy research for most of my career life, and on the side, an investigator of paranormal and UFO phenomena. Along with researching the history of Western occult traditions, astral projection, mad science, and good rootbeer.

Overall, I think the Nazi - UFO connection as has been publicized in a variety of books and articles suffers from the same maladies as general UFOlogy and paranormal media - far too much is based on presumptions and pop theory-turned-mythos. But I will give SS3 a shout-out of approval for breaching the topic here. Maybe it deserves a list or forum of its own, I can't say.

My own position is this - within the grasp of human potential lie both the highest good and powers of creation, as well as the most horrid depravity imaginable. Aliens were certainly not needed to create the thermonuclear-spiritual mega-conflict of WWII and the Holocaust. PolPot, Idi Amin, Stalin, and a host of others can easily show us that.

But there were - from what my own personal delvings have found - deep involvements of magical and occult traditions. As has been written about widely too, albeit in generally a more scholarly venue than most of the UFO authors partake of. For me to deny this overwhelmingly present vector of WWII and its causes would be tantamount to ostrich head-sticking. Where I then take steps over to where SS3 is coming from lies in the view I hold where UFOs are a matter of magical and occult significance anyway.

The efforts I have made to find out what "I" was (for whoever may ultimately define "I" anyway:) in that lifetime have been blocked like a ward or iron gate, regardless of techniques I have used, even astral time-spooling. But such circumstantial "familiarities", habits, interests, and home-sense lead me to suspect that I somehow was involved with esoteric science or research for the Reich. In 2008 and 2009, when I had to make technical consulting and conference trips to Sachsen Anhalt (Leipzig area), Germany for the company I work for, a number of familiarities of air, landscape, the food, even the smiles on the old folks I would meet... spoke of something home-like.

So I guess to wind up this ramble, I will just offer to SS3 that she isn't the only one with such notions here. And that I would very much like to see postings here from folks who may have memories from the WWII involved life that include "anomalies" that seem to be irrational images or scenes.

Apart from that, I can only offer that when I might post something on this "vector" as I call it, I will be as scholarly and even-minded as I can, and as all of you have been from what I can see!

Vielen Dank

nr

[privatetucker]

I haven't been in here in a while, hence all the thread bumping and commenting. I agree very, very much with Iseke on this one, as well as Laurasia.

The fact of the matter is, this was human, and it's human responsibility that is key to healing here. Because if it is blamed on an outside source, than how can anyone ever come to terms with their past? Running away and blaming it on UFOs, to me personally just seems to be another way of actually running away from responsibility and identity instead of correcting the problem.

The idea of Mengele creating those greys with the experimented children makes no sense to me. Granted I am coming from a place of someone who doesn't study these things, but also a place where a little spirit girl, a future child of mine, follows me around like a little duckling, and I have seen her past lifetime before this one. She was a Dutch-Jewish child experimented on by Mengele, which is so horrifying to comprehend that I try not to think about it more than I can help. I was experimented on him too, but in a different way.

You're totally free to believe whatever you want, I'm not saying you're not, but based on what I have seen with Mengele's experimentation, it doesn't seem to make sense. But again, I am coming from a point of view where the topic of UFOs is not studied.